Changeset: 50185141
Updated the MTB4 trail, Livigno
Closed by Fredrik L
Tags
created_by | JOSM/1.5 (12126 SVN en) |
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source | knowledge, GPS data, Carosello 3000 Trail map |
Discussion
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Comment from Constable
hey Fredrik, why did you delete those two relations?
https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/7141935/history
https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/7141934/history
Do you know what relations are? I'm planning to restore them as there was no reason to deleted them but before doing it I'd like to hear from you.
Other than that you've been changing the Blueberry Line trail name, adding the "MTB4" prefix but I'm pretty sure that the "MTB4" prefix should be only put into the "ref" tag http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:ref
Here you can see you edit details http://nrenner.github.io/achavi/?changeset=50185141 and here you can see why relations are not useless and then shouldn't be deleted https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/46.5238/10.1214&layers=C
If you're up there in Livigno I'd suggest you to use the Cyclemap layer on openstreetmap.org and then you'll find those relations to be very useful.
Cheers -
Comment from Constable
An answer would have been much appreciated but never mind, I've restored the two deleted relations.
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Comment from Fredrik L
Hi Constaple,
It was just a mistake from my side. I will check on how to use relations :-)
BTW I noticed there are two old DH tracks where they are now building the new lift. Do you know if they have a name and the difficulty on them?
Regards
Fredrik
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Comment from Fredrik L
I added the "mtb4" stuff since some added trail numbers on the Mottolini side had them and all sign posts in mountain have them. Also, if it's added to the name tag they will be shown on Garmin devices when using overlays like the ones on MTBMap.no
F
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Comment from Constable
Hi, thanks for your answer. I've been there few weeks ago when the bike park was still closed and I've ridden those trails but I don't remember those trails you are talking about, sorry for that.
Talking about the "mtb*" prefix, yeah you're right that the Mottolino trails are mapped with that prefix but to be honest I'm pretty sure that's not correct . We at Openstreetmap have some guidelines to follow and one of them is "not mapping for the render" which means, do not map things to make them look better/appear on the map, it's up to the layer you're using to show some info and hide some others. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Good_practice#Don.27t_map_for_the_renderer
I'm also pretty sure that the trail number mtb* should go only in the ref tag. I'm not going to remove them from the name tag right now but I'm expecting some other expert mapper to do it sooner or later.
Thanks again for your help improving the map.
Cheers -
Comment from Fredrik L
Thanks for the information Constable! I can move the trail numbers to the ref tag on both sides of Livigno to make it consistent (there are not too many MTB trails). And, I guess the same should be done for non bike specific trails.
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Comment from Constable
Thanks for your help, yeah you guess right, the same should be done for non specific mtb trail.
If you have any doubt you can read the wiki http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Main_Page (every tag has a dedicated page) or get in touch with the community using one of the mailing list available (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mailing_lists)
Cheers -
Comment from Fredrik L
Hi again Constable,
I have now done some updates on the Carosello 3000 side of Livigno. I have moved the "MTBx" stuff to the ref tag on each of the (now opened) DH trails + some other stuff. Should there always be a route associated with each DH trail? And if so, should there be a ref tag on both the route and the trail?
Another thing that struck me is the grading of the difficulty of the trails. Comparing to the bike parks here in Norway/Sweden, and the Mottolini trails, I would say that Carrosello trails have green (mtb:scale:imba=0) or blue (mtb:scale:imba=1) and no red (mtb:scale:imba=2) trails. I'm not sure if one should use the official grading of the difficulty or try to relate/normalize the grading to other bike parks?
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Comment from Constable
Hi Fredrik, thaks again for your precious work up here and sorry for my late answer.
I'd say yes to your first question, I mean, if a trail has well defined start and end points (as pretty much every DH trail does) I'd associate every section of it to a relation (also called route), so that people looking at the map can clearly identify the whole trail as one single piece.
I'm not so sure if both the relation and the various trail sections should have the ref tag. I'd say just keep putting them in twice and in the meanwhile I'll ask the Italian mailing list how should we deal with the ref tag.
I don't have much experience mapping bike parks but I'd say that we should map those trails difficult according to the bike park grading, maybe using both mtb:scale:imba and another tag which represents the official grading given by the bike park.
Here again I'm going to ask the Italian mailing list about the best way of mapping it.
If I'll get some good tips by the Italian community I'll write them here.
Thanks again for your help.
Cheers -
Comment from Constable
ref tag as operator and other similar tags should be added only to the relation, that's the answer I got so far.
I'll double check this area in the next weeks and see if some ref needs to be removed.
Cheers
Ways (3)
Relations (2)
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